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Thread: Hydro assist cylinder

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    Hydro assist cylinder

    Anyone know a place localish that would carry something like this. Ideally with a 3/4 shaft. From my researching with a stock modded pump and a tranny cooler this would be the best fit. PA only has 2x8's with no flex ends. Googled a couple local hydraulic shop websites but they don't have flex ends and they look as pricey as PSC. Got some heims kickin around i guess i could weld on to the cylinder if i cant find a flexy. Wonder if TSC would have more or different choices then PA. Pretty sure I can get all lines and fittings from PA. It's almost time to tap the box and mock up the assist. Time to do some learning on pirate. Another question. Being as the Astros box is reverse would the high and low lines be opposite? Searched the P but didn't see anything.

    http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.as...name=hydraulic

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    Talked to Sean briefly in the past, not sure he deals with surplus cylinders. For now just going to run the stock pump ala westexasoffroad mod. Trying to keep it my style and go budget. Attempting to set up the entire assist for around the $150 mark.

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    if you are going to keep our pump you will at the very least need a proper ram, those big goofy agricultural ones will not cut it atall. I would suggest you buy the kit without the pump and try that. Its possible you would be better off keeping your standard steering than cobbling together a slow as fawk assist system.

    ---------- Post added at 05:23 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:21 AM ----------

    and BTW, that mod increases flow, which does you no good if you dont have the psi to back it up.
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    agreed (except about the mod, it will increase pressure but you will run into a volume issue) you will be surprised how much a cylinder will cost through DVS or TMR and they will get you set up with the proper size and ends. when it comes to steering, not only can it be a safety issue, but a huge pain in the ass when its not working to its potential on the trail. Check PBB there is a bunch of guys parting out hydro stuff!
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    ski has one sitting in his showcase r try Cisco on Dixie

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    Guess i'll have to agree to disagree. Why do 90% of the write ups and posts go this route. I dont see how an off the shelf cylinder properly sized with proper sized hoses and fittings, modded pump, good fluid and a cooler can be called cobbled together or unsafe. Vast majority of the threads i've read on pirate use the surplus cylinders and have been for years with great success. Hell, all the links that billavista tech points to are using off the shelf cylinders. I'll admit a $1500 PSC system would be nice but i'm not much into paying someone else to do something i can. And, i'd still be tapping my own box. I'll give the $150 route a try seeing as it is and has worked for so many others for so long.

    Not real sure on buying used from someone south of the boarder but not a bad idea. Thanks Bio, i'll do some snooping today.

    Anyways, anyone know of any good hydraulic shops arounds that stock a large variety of cylinders?

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    Curt,

    2" bore is cylinder assist ram is too big for that pump for street use. It will not have the flow for quick steering movements. If you try to turn quickly, you will simply lose all assist. Not what you want in the middle of any type of emergency manoeuvre. For an assist set up, a high flow pump (like a modded hydro boost pump or a PSC pump) will deal with an 1.75" bore ram and a stock pump will typically deal with a 1.5" bore ram. Exceeded those sizes will only result in unsatisfactory steering performance unless you are going to be having a much higher flowing pump than what we are talking about.

    PSC's assist cylinders are cheap, have the smallest shaft size (5/8", IIRC) which is best for reasonably balanced steering, and are ready for rod ends. It makes no sense to skimp at all in this particular part as you will end up with something that will simply not work properly....and you won't be saving hardly any money, anyway.
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    Quote Originally Posted by U Turn View Post
    ski has one sitting in his showcase r try Cisco on Dixie
    I saw that, so does Tim and Jim. I'm cheap, i'll put my own sticker on . Thanks Dan, i'll look into Cisco.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CTD NUT View Post
    Curt,

    2" bore is cylinder assist ram is too big for that pump for street use. It will not have the flow for quick steering movements. If you try to turn quickly, you will simply lose all assist. Not what you want in the middle of any type of emergency manoeuvre. For an assist set up, a high flow pump (like a modded hydro boost pump or a PSC pump) will deal with an 1.75" bore ram and a stock pump will typically deal with a 1.5" bore ram. Exceeded those sizes will only result in unsatisfactory steering performance unless you are going to be having a much higher flowing pump than what we are talking about.

    PSC's assist cylinders are cheap, have the smallest shaft size (5/8", IIRC) which is best for reasonably balanced steering, and are ready for rod ends. It makes no sense to skimp at all in this particular part as you will end up with something that will simply not work properly....and you won't be saving hardly any money, anyway.
    Thanks man but they are still double the price of off the shelfers. And i hear ya, i'm looking for a 1.5er with a 3/4 shaft and gonna mod my pump. If i come up empty handed so be it, PSC it is.

    ---------- Post added at 08:31 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:30 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by jeepthing84 View Post
    Nice

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curt's_97 View Post
    Guess i'll have to agree to disagree. Why do 90% of the write ups and posts go this route. I dont see how an off the shelf cylinder properly sized with proper sized hoses and fittings, modded pump, good fluid and a cooler can be called cobbled together or unsafe. Vast majority of the threads i've read on pirate use the surplus cylinders and have been for years with great success. Hell, all the links that billavista tech points to are using off the shelf cylinders. I'll admit a $1500 PSC system would be nice but i'm not much into paying someone else to do something i can. And, i'd still be tapping my own box. I'll give the $150 route a try seeing as it is and has worked for so many others for so long.
    I am NOT suggesting that you need to buy a kit. Just the PSC cylinder. Again, they are inexpensive and won't really cost you anymore than from any other supplier. I have no idea what people are doing or if they perform properly on the street in the threads you are referring to but I can assure you that you will need at least a hydro boost pump for an 1.75" ram if you need quick steering for street driving. I have already seen poor (slow) steering with a 1.75" ram and a stock style jeep pump....modded or not. The pumps do not meet the flow demand. This is why 1.5" bore rams are so popular for jeeps. 2" bore is simply out of the question unless you are going to be a running a much higher flowing pump. A TC or P pump will simply not work with a 2" bore ram....on the street.

    As well, I have seen many threads where people scab together surplus crap in the name of saving $100 only to find out they have less than satisfactory steering....I'm sure half are shamed to even admit that and won't even post. I have seen many times where they wished they just bought the PSC ram in the first place after they started threads like : "what's wrong with my steering", etc....

    Now, many people may run these set ups on the trail and they will work fine in a slow speed setting where you do not need fast reacting or reasonable balanced steering.

    If you run on the street or simply demand good steering performance you must match the ram bore size to the available flow your pump can offer. If you do not care about these things, run a 2" bore princess auto ram and carry on.

    And the reason we are directing you towards a PSC type of assist ram is that it is difficult to impossible to find 1.5" - 1.75" rams equipped to accept rod ends with a 5/8" shaft (most are 3/4" +). This is very much a specialty item and not typical within the hydraulics industry. Yes, you can probably find someone to custom build it for you without too much trouble but it will only cost you more money.

    http://www.pscmotorsports.com/Cylind...-Cylinder.html

    http://www.pscmotorsports.com/Cylind...-Cylinder.html

    As you can see, these rams include mounting tabs, rod ends and hardware for that price. There are PSC vendors here that *should* be able to get you some competitive pricing.

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    Hey Curt,
    I modded my own pump and bought the ram kit from westtexas offroad. It's only 220, well it was back when I bought it, The only thing I have changed is the lines, the ones from WTO had 2 90degree elbows on each end of the ram. I had PA make me up some lines that come straight up out of the cyclinder, figured this would be better flow and little less heat build up. Never had an issue with this setup, other than cooling, u definately need a cooler. I will upgrade to a real pump one day, but this works pretty well. I would think ur gonna have to break down and at least buy the proper ram. everything else can be made or had from local farmer shops.

    I'm not sure on the Astro box, but I do remember seeing posts on Pirate where they had the assist lines coming out of the box on the frame side, PITA. I hope that isnt the case for you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curt's_97 View Post
    Thanks man but they are still double the price of off the shelfers.
    But much more than double the value when it works much better...ya know? Really, this seems weird to me in the name of saving $80 (or whatever).


    Quote Originally Posted by Curt's_97 View Post
    i'm looking for a 1.5er with a 3/4 shaft and gonna mod my pump.
    3/4" shaft is just too big of a percentage of an 1.5" bore ram, IMO. Just not worth it. Especially when the moutning configuration is going to be less than desirable as well.

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    I have a tapped cj box (same guts as Astros) and run a PSC 1.5 x 5/8 from DVS and am happy as hell. I'm glad my Dutch genetics didn't take over my sanity on this one. Don't be cheap on the steering. Skip the beer for 48 hours and you would have enough for a gold plated assist setup.

    After taking flak for years for running a dog-leg drag link I didn't feel like explaining the hacked together surplus ram crap.

    Have you ever built an inferior set up (d44) and wish you were smart enough back then to do it right the first time? Here is your first time for steering.
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    x2 on UTurn's suggestion. Cisco on Dixie just north of 401 past Huskey @ Shawson Dr

    We used them for our hydraulic supply for various crane hydraulic lines and equipment

    Grimm

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    ok for assist kits as CTD had already mentioned,

    if your looking for a 1.5" ram, you will need to find one with a 5/8" rod for as balanced setup as you can get in a single ram system.

    if your looking for a 1.75" ram, you can use a 3/4" rod and still get a fairly balanced system, but you will need more pump flow/volume to keep up with it.

    2" out of the question for assist on the road.

    Till Wed at midnight I will do:

    SC-2200K OR SC-2201K cylinder kit complete with Heims/Tabs/Bolts $ 210.00 all in, pick up at my shop.

    SC-2200 OR SC-2201 cylinder only for you cheep buggers $ 165.00 all in, pick up at my shop

    http://www.pscmotorsports.com/Cylind...-Cylinder.html

    http://www.pscmotorsports.com/Cylind...-Cylinder.html

    If I have your order by Wed night via PM I will place it on this weeks stock order and you will have it for next weekend.

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    I'd even offer to pick it up for you Curt... 'cept I'll be out of town from the 10th to the 20th.... otherwise I'm Burlington and back every weekend.
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    Now thats an offer you can`t refuse.
    I have a http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.as...name=hydraulic from princess auto that was given to me. Doesn`t work as well for turning right in the rocks like the above people mentioned and had to weld ends on to accept heims. Same physical size as the PSC housing though, just a 3/4 shaft. If you had to buy it off the shelf I can`t see it being much less then $125+tx

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    Well, you all. lol. Let me know when it shows up Sean and i'll see if i can't find someone to pick it up for me. Thanks again.

    Decided on the 1.75" PSC. Figured i'll deal with it a bit slow for now and leave some room to upgrade when i save a couple bucks for a new pump. cough cough or until mine blows. lol

    Gonna do up some PA hoses with screw in fittings for ease of trail fixing and grab an extra piece of hose for parts kits.

    Now, more questions. lol

    1. Same Astro box question.

    2. What size cooler? There are 2 styles no? like the cone looking one and a rad looking one? I get a smokin deal from a buddy that works at napa so probably go there. Some cheap generic cooler i would assume?

    3. Stock pump resevoir, will it be big enough.

    Thanks again and carry on. Some great tech in here.

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