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Thread: 88 YJ mini-update 4 wheelin

  1. #21
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    i'll take a pm too. my interest has been peeked
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    picked up the jeep today, man what a difference !!

    now I can see going ahead with some of other mod's once the weather gets warmer.
    special talent..to screw things up at the push of a button.

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    was that you near princess auto in hamilton today?
    WHAT WOULD MACGYVER DO?

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    Pm me details also

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    i would go ahead and post a list and a name, so you can save someone else from being taken!! 6G's for a swap of that nature is ridiculous, unless that swap was putting your tub on a tj frame. without a list of everything that was done this is all simply speculation, so please make me eat my words and throw up a good bump for the shop or let everyone know who not to go to!
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  6. #26
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    ok, so here it is;

    used FI 4.0 140,000 km c/w "everything I need to do the change over " , ie wiring harness, fuel tank & sender, exhaust pipe, refurbished head, etc. etc. ( $500 from "jeep newb" )
    Borla Header, new, ( $300 from v1nc3 )...no complaints, nice unit c/w gasket.
    numerous used parts from Brandon's 91 YJ part-out, life saver for sure, NO complaints !( $500...but still owe him a bit. Tazz91yj Thanks man ! )

    end result of the motor install is that the quality of work is good, just that so many older parts couldn't be used, and new parts were required, the cost was double the original expectation. ( close to 6K by Jeepman's Offroad ) Here is the list;
    fuel pump assembly, serp belt, PS pulley, Engine mounts,water pump, WP inlet tube, Thermostat housing, Thermostat gasket, thermostat, fuel injector clamps, heater hose, hose clamps, fuel filter, frost plugs, block heater, timing set, pilot bearing, spark plugs, spark plug wires, distributor, head gasket, fuel injectors, exhaust collector pipe, exhaust bung, exhaust rubber hanger, tailpipe, smooth idler pulley, wpier blades, magnaflow muffler, SS universal cat, air filter, dipstick, fuel sender gasket, alternator, radiator 3 core, machine flywheel. $2363.00 tax in. refurbished parts for fuel & air delivery system approx $ 1000.00. labour $2000 for swap, $1000 for extras.

    hindsight 20 / 20.... I wouldn't do it again, but the jeep is really running good now.

  7. #27
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    Hmmm...maybe my math is off, but when I add up all the numbers:

    $500 for the engine from Jeep Newb
    $300 for the header from v1nce
    $500 (not sure who this went too, either Brandon's YJ part-out or Tazz91YJ <--unclear to me
    $2363 for parts to Jeepman's Offroad
    *EDIT* $1000 for refurbished parts for fuel & air delivery system (I am assuming to Jeepman's Offroad) *EDIT*
    $2000 in labour for the swap (I am assuming to Jeepman's Offroad)
    $1000 in "extras" (not really sure what you mean by this)

    ...adds up to $7663...

    *EDIT* Text above listed in YELLOW was originally included by Mike in the above post, but was unintentionally omitted by me when originally making this post. *EDIT*


    Like you said, hindsight 20/20 and it was more than what you expected to pay...your words were "double the original expectation"...



    MY OPINION ---> I think it was a lot to spend on an 'old YJ', but I have seen your Jeep and it is one of the cleanest YJs I have ever seen, not many unmolested YJs out there that are not in need of significant body and frame work, but yours is definitely one of the few...



    I am a little confused why a relatively low mileage engine needed so many parts thrown at it...my speculation is the job is pretty involved and it was a situation of 'it's not really needed, but if were this far into it might as well do it, just to be safe down the road' and that kind of thinking isn't a bad thing, but as you have found out, it does add a lot of unforeseen costs...I hope, for you, after all those unforeseen costs and new parts that this engine lasts a long time for you without issues.



    I think I find it hard to believe there was so much cost and so many parts (in what seems like anything that could be unbolted was replaced), but there was no machine work required (aside from the flywheel). Might have been better starting with a fresh long block...who knows...maybe I am talking out my ass on that one, but a quick web search finds a Jeep 4L long block for $3000 (granted the one I found was out of Texas, but I can't see them be drastically more money up here).

    As for labour costs, depending on what the hourly rate was (I am assuming in the $100/hour neighbourhood - a reasonable amount for the typical automotive repair facility), I would say the dollar figure for labour was spot on for an engine swap of this kind.



    Was it worth it? I think you summed it up by saying you wouldn't do it again.

    I am happy to hear it is running great, and I know you will enjoy it!!!




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  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by igotafrigginjeep View Post
    Hmmm...maybe my math is off, but when I add up all the numbers:

    $500 for the engine from Jeep Newb
    $300 for the header from v1nce
    $500 (not sure who this went too, either Brandon's YJ part-out or Tazz91YJ <--unclear to me
    $2363 for parts to Jeepman's Offroad
    $2000 in labour for the swap (I am assuming to Jeepman's Offroad)
    $1000 in "extras" (not really sure what you mean by this)

    ...adds up to $7663...


    Like you said, hindsight 20/20 and it was more than what you expected to pay...your words were "double the original expectation"...



    MY OPINION ---> I think it was a lot to spend on an 'old YJ', but I have seen your Jeep and it is one of the cleanest YJs I have ever seen, not many unmolested YJs out there that are not in need of significant body and frame work, but yours is definitely one of the few...



    I am a little confused why a relatively low mileage engine needed so many parts thrown at it...my speculation is the job is pretty involved and it was a situation of 'it's not really needed, but if were this far into it might as well do it, just to be safe down the road' and that kind of thinking isn't a bad thing, but as you have found out, it does add a lot of unforeseen costs...I hope, for you, after all those unforeseen costs and new parts that this engine lasts a long time for you without issues.



    I think I find it hard to believe there was so much cost and so many parts (in what seems like anything that could be unbolted was replaced), but there was no machine work required (aside from the flywheel). Might have been better starting with a fresh long block...who knows...maybe I am talking out my ass on that one, but a quick web search finds a Jeep 4L long block for $3000 (granted the one I found was out of Texas, but I can't see them be drastically more money up here).

    As for labour costs, depending on what the hourly rate was (I am assuming in the $100/hour neighbourhood - a reasonable amount for the typical automotive repair facility), I would say the dollar figure for labour was spot on for an engine swap of this kind.



    Was it worth it? I think you summed it up by saying you wouldn't do it again.

    I am happy to hear it is running great, and I know you will enjoy it!!!




    When do the lift and big donuts go on?
    jeffy your math is off, try again, unless you are adding an extra 1000 in there that your didn't list
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    Wow the cost seems a little excessive. I did a 350 swap in my CJ for around a grand. Mind you I did the work myself but maybe only had 10-15 hours into it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeannie View Post
    jeffy your math is off, try again, unless you are adding an extra 1000 in there that your didn't list
    sorry, yes I missed a $1000 that Mike had originally listed...list should read:

    $500 for the engine from Jeep Newb
    $300 for the header from v1nce
    $500 (not sure who this went too, either Brandon's YJ part-out or Tazz91YJ <--unclear to me
    $2363 for parts to Jeepman's Offroad
    $1000 for refurbished parts for fuel & air delivery system (I am assuming to Jeepman's Offroad)
    $2000 in labour for the swap (I am assuming to Jeepman's Offroad)
    $1000 in "extras" (not really sure what you mean by this)

    ...adds up to $7663...

    The text in yellow was originally listed by Mike, I had unintentionally omitted it when transcribing my thoughts..my post has been edited to reflect this...

  11. #31
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    just to clear up for u IGFJ mike grabbed a whole wack of parts off me, my name is Brandon lol......mike, no problem man, anytime, glad to hear u finally got her back and its got some new life. And like IGFJ said ur yj is super clean and will last a while.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by igotafrigginjeep View Post
    sorry, yes I missed a $1000 that Mike had originally listed...list should read:

    $500 for the engine from Jeep Newb
    $300 for the header from v1nce
    $500 (not sure who this went too, either Brandon's YJ part-out or Tazz91YJ <--unclear to me
    $2363 for parts to Jeepman's Offroad
    $1000 for refurbished parts for fuel & air delivery system (I am assuming to Jeepman's Offroad)
    $2000 in labour for the swap (I am assuming to Jeepman's Offroad)
    $1000 in "extras" (not really sure what you mean by this)

    ...adds up to $7663...

    The text in yellow was originally listed by Mike, I had unintentionally omitted it when transcribing my thoughts..my post has been edited to reflect this...
    If you add up all the new and used parts and take out the labour it honestly doesn't sound that crazy at all. It's not hard to see where the money went. That's by choice. Many D.I.Y. guys would simply grab the best 4.0L they can find with the most useable accessories and go from there. The misc. stuff many of us would have laying around our parts bins and shops which would keep costs down. I don't think you can really finger point here because the numbers seem to be pretty normal for new/refurb components and labour on that end.

    When has it ever been cheap to put all new parts on an engine and do a total swap at a shop? If you wanted to cut corners and save then yeah I can definitely see where it could be done cheaper, but let's be realistic it would be about $4000 with labour and even used parts at a shop regardless. So the additional added items in new or refurb condition plus the exhaust header for $300 make up the extra couple thousand no problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NINE-T-1-RENEGADE View Post
    If you add up all the new and used parts and take out the labour it honestly doesn't sound that crazy at all. It's not hard to see where the money went. That's by choice. Many D.I.Y. guys would simply grab the best 4.0L they can find with the most useable accessories and go from there. The misc. stuff many of us would have laying around our parts bins and shops which would keep costs down. I don't think you can really finger point here because the numbers seem to be pretty normal for new/refurb components and labour on that end.

    When has it ever been cheap to put all new parts on an engine and do a total swap at a shop? If you wanted to cut corners and save then yeah I can definitely see where it could be done cheaper, but let's be realistic it would be about $4000 with labour and even used parts at a shop regardless. So the additional added items in new or refurb condition plus the exhaust header for $300 make up the extra couple thousand no problem.
    Not disputing that, and didn't point fingers...just couldn't wrap my head around it when Mike first made the 6Gs comment without any details...the highlighted text was just to highlight something I had previously missed and was adding in an edit, not trying to centre out that portion of text for further attention.



    In fact, what I said in regards to all the new parts was...

    Quote Originally Posted by igotafrigginjeep View Post
    my speculation is the job is pretty involved and it was a situation of 'it's not really needed, but if were this far into it might as well do it, just to be safe down the road' and that kind of thinking isn't a bad thing, but as you have found out, it does add a lot of unforeseen costs


    ...and in regards to the work being done at a shop...

    Quote Originally Posted by igotafrigginjeep View Post
    As for labour costs, depending on what the hourly rate was (I am assuming in the $100/hour neighbourhood - a reasonable amount for the typical automotive repair facility), I would say the dollar figure for labour was spot on for an engine swap of this kind.

    I still think it is a lot of money to put into an older Jeep, and that is from a standpoint of recovering any of that value at a later date...I am of the camp that feels when you put money into your Jeep for mods, you are basically throwing it away, you will never recover it...and sometimes you will be losing on the deal as some mods can easily devalue the vehicle to the average buyer.




    I think the biggest thing that shouldn't be missed by anyone is Mike's own comment...

    Quote Originally Posted by O skule View Post
    the cost was double the original expectation
    Really points out that the total costs of a mod need to be fully explored before starting into them...and that goes for any mod, not just an engine swap...and just generalizing a comment and not relating directly to this situation or any other --> there is two sides that need to explore the total costs of a mod...the owner of the vehicle and the shop/retailer...everybody needs to be on the same page so there isn't an issue in the end...I am sure some people have experienced a situation where they are a good chunk of money into something when they realize they are TOO far into it...what do you do? Cut your losses? Or did you trudge ahead, get it down, but be out some more money...it's a tough call either way.




    Quote Originally Posted by Tazz91yj View Post
    just to clear up for u IGFJ mike grabbed a whole wack of parts off me, my name is Brandon lol......mike, no problem man, anytime, glad to hear u finally got her back and its got some new life. And like IGFJ said ur yj is super clean and will last a while.
    Hey Brandon, thanks for clearing that up...LOL...always just new you as Tazz, and not the OTHER Tazz, but THE Tazz that many people have talked about, who have had good dealings, fair prices, and no issues...never had dealings with you myself, but friends have and never a negative thing to say...

  14. #34
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    Brandon is a BRO no question !
    my double the expectation comment has to do with the "original" expectation whereby approx. $800 could secure a good used engine, and $ 2500 to $3000 would get it installed. Granted those were just rough estimates but based on appaerent going rates and labour estimate. It was the " might swell's " combined with the inordinate number of items that differ between the 91 engine and the 88 hulk, and my lack of knowledge that a header would mean new exhaust required too, etc. etc. etc.
    It now roars like a lion and is reliable enough to be my DD, and may soon sport some of the other junk I been pushing into the garage.

    ps. any advice on how I could tell if the used 410 axles I got are good B4 I proceed to plan thier install would be appreciated.

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    Holly hairy hookers! You could of bought a TJ, thrown on a long arm kit and slapped on some 35's for that. Or just bought a nice crate 350 if you're a square light leaf lover. Shitty deal Mike but at least it's running. Chalk that one up to learning the hard way.
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