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Thread: Saturn brakes

  1. #1
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    Saturn brakes

    I just replaced the brake shoes on my Saturn and in doing the job I realized that the wheel cylinders has to be replaced. I replaced them and have bled and bled and bled them but the pedal still does not feel as good as it did. It stops the car but not as well as it should.

    I took it apart again yesterday and re-adjusted the shoes so that the drums would drag on them. Basically as close as I could go before not being able to get the drum back on. Also, re-bled all 4 corners. I almost used a pint of breke fluid last night. Probably more than 10 cycles of pump, pump, pump, hold, open bleeder, close bleeder, release pedal. on each corner. And about that many the night before.

    The e-brake feels tight so they should be adjusted proberly, but even it does not stop the car that well.

    AM I missing something here in the process. I can't see how bleeding them again will do anything and I don't want to pay $80 for a mechanic to do it and it not be any better.

    Maybe this is all in my head, but I swear it stopped alot better before.
    93 YJ
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    do vaccum bleeders or pressure bleeders really work all that well?

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    Yes, both systems work. Pressure bleeders are amazing, but a pain to set up. Vacuum bleeders (most common) are good enough for most jobs.

    Does the vehicle have ABS? If so, go find some gravel and hit the brakes hard. Make sure each of the wheels have a skid condition. You may need to rebleed after the ABS has been cycled.
    ....-Noltz
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    how are your drums?

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    actuall the power bleeders are very simple now and sometimes cheaper then the vacume. and yes they make a huge difference. sounds like you may have the prop valve partly snapped over and best way to fix is power bleed as your car should have a four line diagonal system. basically the new power bleeder is a small manual pump fertiliser tank for spraying weeds on your lawn and a new plastic cap for your master with a hose fitting. if you look online you will get the idea. you must bleed them in the order of pass rear wheel pass front wheel drivers rear wheel and the drivers front bleed each one 3 times pump, pump, pump , bleed. then start over 2 times each wheel then 1 time each wheel making 3 trips around the car in total. after that sitting in the drivers seat Kick the brake pedal 2 or 3 times without holding the pedal after the kick. This has never failed to correct the system for me.

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    This might be a pointless question, but, does the Saturn have ABS?

    If I was a Jeep, they'd have parted me out a LONG time ago.

    I'm a proud member of SOXJA ask me why!

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    nope, no ABS.
    I thought the order was supposed to be furthest to closest, so I did pr, dr, pf, df.

    Maybe i'll start looking for a power bleeder then. I'll try the order you gave me above.

    what do you mean by the prop valve could be partly snapped over?

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    the drums seem fine. I would think about that too but they stopped the car just fine before I touched anything

    What is the kick accomplishing?

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    you might have to adjust the brakes with the drum in place till there is slight drag.

    sometimes there is a small ridge on the drum and its wont go back on with the shoes in the right spot.

    new shoes and pads wont work well unless you replace or machine the drums/rotors.

    brakes for domestics are so cheep i would just change them no sence cheeping out on your brakes

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    I made sure that there is a slight drag on them. I think they actually may be adjusted right since the e-brake feels pretty good and tight. I might do the drums though.

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    After looking up the power bleeder mentioned above, everybody that uses it seems to swear by it. Anybody know where I can get one in Canada at a good price.

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    I cant take this anymore. I took off all 4 wheels and bled with somebody pumping the pedal 4 times each wheel going around the car 3 times. Gave the pedal a few good kicks and it is not any better than it was before.
    Is there a way to test the master cylinder while it is still in the car? There cant be any air anywhere. Did not machine the drums since it was too late to bring them in today. But I am pretty sure that the brakes were better than they are now, so the drums should not be causing sloppy braking.
    Why the hell cant I figure this out?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by His Royal Jeepness View Post
    I made sure that there is a slight drag on them. I think they actually may be adjusted right since the e-brake feels pretty good and tight. I might do the drums though.
    you can only adjust the drums.

    new ones are cheaper than resurfacing as long as your shopping at a+a on woodward.

    you have to adjust the shoes on the car with the drums on.

    your peddle height is set by the by the shoes.

    come see me i will set them up for nothing it will take 5 min

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    ok how many miles have you drove the car cause until they seat and ware in there gonna feel alot weaker then before, it takes about 100-200km for this.

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    i do about 150 km a day so they really should have seated by now.

    Andy, are you gonna be around tomorrow or tuesday evening somewhere? I can meet you wherever. I wouldn't be able to until late tomorrow but am good the rest of the week. Right now, I am really appreciating the offer.

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    no problem you know where i am im in all week late after 5pm till around 930

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    thanks man. I'll probably come by tomorrow. Shouldn't the shoes adjust themselves though? Isn't that the point of the star wheel. I tried pulling the parking brake a bunch of times as well as driving in reverse and hitting the brakes a bunch of times.

    Actually I don't even think that there is access to the star wheel with the drum on. We'll see...

  18. #18
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    i will check out all the items of interest whith the front and rear brakes and give you some tips on there operation

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    Did you get this figured out tonight?

    I'm wondering if there was crap in the master, and when you bled it you put the seal through a rough spot, resulting in an internal leak from the primary to the secondary.

    There is a way to test brake like pressures, but the kit is expensive and not thus many people have it. You may have damaged your master. Fortunately it's a non-ABS unit so the master would be cheap & easy to replace.

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    Nope, not figured out yet.

    I stopped by Andy's shop last night but he was not around.
    I can stop, just not as hard as I want. But now I'm wondering if the brakes were ever that good to begin with. I don't go around hammering on the brakes all the time,

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